Interview with Abel Ferrara
By Suncica Unevska
"Violence is a way of life for someone, but it is not life," emphasized one of America's most prominent independent authors. "Violence is a negation of existence, of life. But I can’t talk about violence, because that is the reality. I think violence breeds violence. "I make films, trying to understand where the violence comes from and why people live in delusion."
Abel Ferrara (1951), definitely one of the most distinctive and provocative American independent authors, who has long had a cult status, arrived at the 54th Vienna Film Festival (20.10-2.11.2016) because of the honor that the festival did to the famous actor Christopher Walken, who often played in his films. It is really rare, as rare as Ferrara himself, because it seems to have completely cleared his ego. Simple, approachable, speaks briefly, but very substantially and always with strong views. "Saint of the misery of the film" would be the best description of the man who in his films ("The Driller Killer" 1979, "Fear City" 1984, "King of New York" 1990, "Bad Lieutenant" 1992, "Dangerous Game" 1993 , "Addiction" 1995, "Mary" 2005, "Pasolini" 2014) often deals with urban rot.
At the Gartenbaukino we were able to see your film “Addiction” (1995) again and the audience again had a number of questions, as if it’s a question of the latest and most up-to-date film. Referring to the "Addiction" and "King of New York", which were shown here, I wonder where is for you the connection between Catholicism and evil, between Buddhism and murder ?
AF: It's all, in fact, on a spiritual level. I can talk about evil, about the crisis, about violence, about murder, I can talk about Buddhism, about the Dalai Lama, it all has the same message, a message of compassion, of simpathy, which is the opposite of killing, the opposite from putting one's own ego first. Although seemingly opposite, the film "Addiction" essentially deals with the feeling of the other, with the care, with the commitment to the new life of the group, the commitment to take care of the needs of others.
Violence is a very common theme in your movies. Why, maybe that's your way of fighting it?
AF: Violence is a way of life for someone, but it is not life. Violence is a negation of existence, of life. But, I can’t talk about violence, because that is the reality. I think violence breeds violence, but we accept it. I make films, trying to understand where violence comes from and why people live in delusion.
In fact, if we look at from the other side, these are questions of morality. How did you grow up, what was your neighborhood like, how much did your Catholic upbringing affect you?
AF: I grew up in an ideal neighborhood, in the Bronx in the Italian-American Quarter. Violence does not come from outside, it is personal, individual, it usually comes from home. But I think the most important thing is to be honest with yourself and responsible. You can not talk about violence or condemn what is happening in the world without cleaning the house. Everything is a matter of choice, but in my opinion, there must be personal responsibility. You are responsible for everything you do or you don’t. No matter what religion it is. Movies have to talk about that, about responsibility, about moral issues, whether we like it or not. We talk about morality even when we don’t think about it.
But, it is not just on the streets, many people think that violence is an expression of power and in some situations they even talk about revenge as a justified answer. So it was at the highest level in America after 9/11, what I think you are talking about refers, cleaning at home, although we must say that most don’t see it that way, nor are they aware of that responsibility!?
AF: Unfortunately, violence has power and there is no justification for it. And again, regardless of all the knowledge that people will achieve, we are at the beginning if we think we can hurt someone when we preach violence, but believers do it and it all gets very complicated. Believe me, I do not have all the answers. I make films, trying to understand how somebody can be pious and preach violence. George W. Bush goes to church, prays for all of us, but after 9/11 he wants revenge, that's anger, that's very contradictory. Americans, like me, have been protected whole life, except in Vietnam, no one has ever invaded my city. But, when it first occurs you feel helpless, you want blood, you want someone to die. The movies remind me of that and I can't accept that.
It’s characteristic that Catholicism was very much present in your films. But now, you have decided to become a Buddhist, why?
AF: Well, it all made sense to me. Buddhism somehow allows me to think more clearly. You can’t take drugs to meditate, it is a delusion. Buddhism carries a very practical philosophy of life, it sits you down in the right way, it makes you follow, listen, learn, the results are not ideal, but positive and real. It is a very practical way of life, here I am meditating and right now.
But, except religion, you have also changed your place of residence. New York was and is a major theme in your movies, however, you decided to live in Rome. What has changed?
AF: I lived in New York for 50 years, this is my home. You know, I'm a simple filmmaker, I'm talking about New York because I know him, I can’t make films about a place I haven’t seen. Everything I talk about was part of my life, across the street, it's my world, there is no mystery here. I stayed in Rome, because here I found everything we are talking about. The attitude towards the family, there is a spirit here, there is an understanding, an understanding of the culture, it is part of our life. This is not all about money, the attitude is different, the attitude towards oneself, towards your loved ones, towards children, towards food, towards enjoyment, towards true values. This is a wonderful place to live.
Have you ever made compromises to make a film or to get closer to your audience?
AF: No, never, I'm the audience. I did not make compromise, it would not be me. The most important thing is to be connected with myself, with the people around me, then I will be connected with the audience. You saw that I sat in the audience and watched the movie "Addiction" with you again, I am part of the audience.
Many say you are controversial and provocative author, but what is your real goal?
AF: To see the truth, to learn, to reach the level of engagement with the world, to bring yourself closer to people. Isolation is not good, rejection, you have to communicate, to be one of a thousand, it may not make you better, but it will make you human. Loneliness and isolation can make things worse. If you do not see well, if you do not connect in the right way, you will end up in an illusion. And, whether it is something controversial depends on the film, depends on the audience, which is not the same everywhere. What is controversial in Rome, may not be the same in Moldova.
You often talk about evil. What is evil for you, do you believe in evil?
AF: It is a delusion to think that sometimes it’s necessary to be negative. I do not believe in the devil, but I believe that bad actions create bad actions. Often propaganda has a big role, it is a tool, as well as religion. You need to live in the right way, to feel, to see, to recognize. The philosophy of Buddhism says that, above all, is to be a human being, not to live in a lie, not to suffer, not to be evil for no reason, to see things clearly, to accept the truth. Evil can not bring good, it can only destroy it. It's always about whether you make the right choice or the wrong one, you can’t ignore the guilt.
Vices are always in the focus of your interest. Do you have vices?
AF: Only Jesus hasn’t. The movies talk about morality, whether the director likes it or not. It is a matter of choice, of what choice you will make. You choose and there is no going back. I have long perceived this on the basis of my Catholic upbringing. But, no matter what the religion, it speaks more about your karma, your responsibility, and the fact that you will reap what you saw. On one way or another, every movie has to ask those questions.
In your films, people often change making a total turn in their lives. Do you believe that people can really change?
AF: Absolutely. You change every day, every second. It is about constantly changing. For example, you can never find yourself in the same river, because the river is not the same. You change whether you like it or not. The world at the same time is a shocking and a valuable and amazing place and you have to be open-minded. It is again something that is above human desire, you can think that you love what you are, that you are satisfied with where you are, that you want to keep what you have, that is, in essence, you want to control own space. But, you are only fooling yourself, because you have no control.
Does genre and style matter to you when working on movies, or it is coming afterwards?
AF: It depends on the story. The story starts from the imagination, from your choice, you make a choice of a book, a story that someone told you, something that happened from your personal life, whatever you choose you should feel, that is the right way for a filmmaker.
Over the years, what has changed in terms of your work, topics, approach?
AF: Everything has changed. I change every day, the people I work with, nothing stays the same, but that's the beauty. We must accept the changes, in them lies the challenge and the temptation and the knowledge. Everything is constantly changing and thank God that is so!
(November 2016)
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